Questions on setup & process with Amazon (login & pay)

I've just had our first few orders come in with the new Amazon "Login and Pay" method. This really looks _great_ as a customer experience on the checkout page!

However, things aren't quite as smooth for us after the transaction.

In the Amazon Seller Central, the successful orders are listed as status either "open" or "closed." It's not obvious at all what the difference between these orders is-- why should some orders be created in the "open" and some in the "closed" status? (In both cases, the full amount has already been collected.)

Side issue: None of the ones created in the "open" state can be closed.

Bigger problem: All of these orders (open or closed) still show as "pending" in FoxyCart. I believe that I have set up the IPN correctly, but is there something else that needs to be done? We have customers asking for their receipts, and we don't have them.

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  • fc_adamfc_adam FoxyCart Team
    @oskay,

    Sorry to hear you're experiencing issues - and thanks for whispering your details.

    If those settings you whispered are a direct copy from your Amazon settings - it looks like you have an error in the IPN URL, as it features a double-up of .com. An incorrect IPN configuration would result in your transactions all being marked as pending.
  • oskayoskay Member
    Ha! Thank you-- A second set of eyes certainly helps. :)

    Once that's working, what status at Amazon corresponds to a FC state of Not-Pending?
  • fc_adamfc_adam FoxyCart Team
    @oskay,

    A FoxyCart state of not-pending is equal to an Amazon status of closed. For the transactions still marked as open in Amazon, could you email us a screenshot that shows the statuses and the transaction reference ID's? We'll get in touch with Amazon and confirm that for you.
  • rjamisonrjamison Member, Amazon
    Hi oskay,

    The "open" state means the order is still available to charge. Amazon Payments allows for you to charge up to 115% of the authorized order amount up to $75 in case you need to make small adjustments such as for shipping fees. Orders are closed if they are cancelled before capturing funds, they are refunded or if they're made via a recurring charge.


    Thanks,

    Robert
  • evgevg FoxyCart Team
    @oskay,

    As of the "Pending" status on our side, I double checked the code and figured out the match of the order states is a bit different.
    The transaction is marked as non-pending in FoxyCart when we get a notification from Amazon that the authorization was successful. So it's not related on the Amazon state of the order reference.
    If IPN is set up correctly, all your complete orders should be in "non-pending" state finally (it usually happens within minutes after authorization).
    Could you confirm everything works as expected after you have fixed the IPN endpoint URL?
    Thank you.
  • oskayoskay Member
    rjamison said:
    The "open" state means the order is still available to charge. [...] Orders are closed if they are cancelled before capturing funds, they are refunded or if they're made via a recurring charge.
    I agree about the "open" part, but my best understanding (for multiple reasons including the balance in our account) is that you are not correct about the meaning of the "closed" state.

    Your examples for "closed" are essentially equivalent to "canceled."
    However, the transactions listed as closed do show that the funds were collected. The balance in our account reflects that both the "open" and "closed" transactions represent successfully processed transactions.

    According to the help for a given transaction,
    [Open] Indicates that you can collect a payment with or without previous authorizations.
    And
    [Closed] Indicates that the payment is closed. You can only collect payment if you have previously requested authorizations. The following reasons indicate why an approved payments can be closed:

    The approved payment has passed its validity period of 180 days.
    You collected the maximum allowed amount. Amazon allows charges of up to 15% or $75 (whichever is less) above the order total submitted by you to Amazon Payments.
    You already requested the maximum number of charges for the order. Amazon Payments allows up to 10 charges per approved payment.
    Amazon closed the payment because an A-to-z claim was decided against you or there were other internal issues.
    You closed the payment.
    The specific reason given as to why the "closed" transactions are listed in the "closed" state is that
    You already requested the maximum number of charges for the order. Amazon Payments allows up to 10 charges per approved payment.
    Whereas the "open" transactions have a legend that indicates that payment can be collected. (Puzzling, since it already has been collected.)


    Also, I have asked both Amazon tech support and here why some orders are arriving in the open state and some in the closed state, and in both cases, you have answered by explaining what "open" and "closed" mean (there correctly, and here with a best guess, perhaps?), instead of actually answering the question that I asked, which is WHY some of the orders are showing up in the open state, and some in the closed state, and (separately) why the "open" orders cannot be closed?
  • oskayoskay Member
    @evg:
    Everything appears to be working correctly on the FoxyCart side now. Both the "open" and "closed" states at Amazon correspond to "approved" payments now. :D

    Thanks for your help!
  • brettbrett FoxyCart Team
    @oskay, thanks for bringing this up. We talked with Amazon a bit about this, and there was agreement that things were awkward. They might be working to improve their UI at some point, and of course we'll do what we can to make things more clear on our end as well. So thanks again for pointing it out. That helps us improve :)
  • oskayoskay Member
    Thanks @brett;
    I really appreciate all of your help-- catching my occasional (and very obvious) errors, smoothing the edges, and squashing those occasional bugs.
  • brettbrett FoxyCart Team
    @oskay, you're at least equally appreciated for your continued pointing our of bugs and rough edges :)
  • oskayoskay Member
    @rjamison
    We had two duplicate orders placed through Amazon Login & Pay today, that we are trying to refund. One showed up as "open" and one as "closed."

    However, Amazon is unwilling to refund the one that is "closed" under any circumstances. Have you ANY POSSIBLE JUSTIFICATION for operating a payments service that offers no possibility of refunds? WTF? (And apparently, to randomly designated payments?)

    If it's really like this, I think that we need to stop using Amazon payments altogether. This is seriously screwed up.
  • evgevg FoxyCart Team
    Hi @oskay,
    I'm sorry you experienced an issue like this.
    Can you whisper me the store domain name? I'd like to take a look at the logs to find out why you have two duplicate orders.
  • evgevg FoxyCart Team
    @oskay, sorry, I found your details in an earlier message.
  • oskayoskay Member
    @evg
    Thanks for looking into this. We're turning off Amazon as a payment method at our store until there's some indication that it's less broken.
  • evgevg FoxyCart Team
    edited May 2015
    Hi Windell,

    Are you talking about two transactions made today with a 4 minutes difference?
    Did you have a chance to talk to the customer why it had happened? Was our checkout process confusing so they had to retry it?
  • oskayoskay Member
    @evg,
    The customer contacted us and said that they weren't sure if it went through, and then placed a second order. We haven't had other cases or reports like this, so my best guess is that it's an isolated incident.
  • oskayoskay Member
    FoxyCart Team: it's apparently VERY IMPORTANT that some orders go through as "open" and others as "closed" -- there *must* be a difference somewhere.

    Our order that went through at 6:26 was recorded as "open" and the order at 6:30 as "closed." Any possible difference between those on the FoxyCart side?
  • evgevg FoxyCart Team
    edited May 2015
    @oskay,

    We have a patch already. It's going to be released soon.
    After applying the patch we'll be closing all orders.

    If you want to know the details: the difference between open and closed state is the following. When the order is open, you're allowed to charge additional money (up to 15%) to cover your shipping and other expenses that may occur. Currently we don't close orders explicitly so they stay open for 180 days. Then they are closed by Amazon automatically.
    As of the closed orders you see - these are created by the customers who gave you a consent to charge their accounts any time (the checkbox at the bottom of the checkout page). These orders are closed by Amazon immediately.
    That's the only difference between these two states.

    @rjamison may want to add something but I hope my answer was detailed enough.

    Again, we're going to release a patch soon so you'll start seeing only closed orders.
    Thank you again for bringing it to our attention.
  • oskayoskay Member
    @evg,
    Sounds excellent with one exception: When we tried to process the refunds this morning, and had difficulty, Amazon's customer service informed us (in writing...) of their policy:
    Also note that Order ##### is in Closed status thus no additional transactions will be processed, including Refunds[...]
    Given that, I think that it would be a major mistake to automatically close transactions-- meaning that absolutely no orders placed through Amazon could ever be cancelled and refunded or partially refunded.
  • brettbrett FoxyCart Team
    Thanks, @oskay. We'll have a discussion with Amazon about this to see what's going on. I agree, … it's incredibly strange that no refunds would ever be allowed, particularly since closed orders happen automatically in certain circumstances (as @evg explained).
  • oskayoskay Member
    OK, False alarm!

    Amazon Support just wrote back to me and said that they were wrong about what they said earlier. (Whew!) Closed transactions can still be refunded, so your approach should really be A-OK.
  • oskayoskay Member
    Any progress on that discussion with Amazon? At this point, it appears that refunds are not possible, with the current FoxyCart integration. I would really like to offer Amazon payments on our store, but there's a major bug here-- this simply isn't production-ready.
  • fc_adamfc_adam FoxyCart Team
    @oskay,

    We're actually just reaching out to Amazon support on another issue - we'll touch base with them in regards to refunds as well.
  • oskayoskay Member
    It looks like everything is working out here -- for our store at least -- thanks to some heroics from Brent from Amazon's support team. We're going to go ahead and turn Amazon payments back on for our store (Yay!). From what we can tell, there may still be some issue from others in our general boat, but Amazon's product team is now well aware of the problem, and is working on it.
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